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Board: ELT e-reading group |
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''The Red Room' by H.G. Wells' - ChrisL (210 posts) October 11th, 2008, 11:04 AM (58 replies)
Dear All
Back to one of the classics of short stories in English. The text of this October is 'The Red Room', a story that, we hope, will engage you and make you think about the power of fear and human imagination and beliefs.
H. G. Wells was born in 1866 and is now best remembered for his science fiction novels, but he was also a prolific short story writer.
Click here to read and download the story from the Project Gutenberg website.
Looking forward to reading your comments
Cheers - Chris
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Tanguene (215 posts) October 15th, 2008, 03:18 PM
Dear All,
It was a good reading! Simple characters (but nameless, which make me doubt if they're really simple). The moral of the story is peharps in this line - "The worst of all the things that haunt poor mortal men," - fear. So, no fear is best!
As I was reading down the story my expectation was to see the old characters telling the young one:Listen when you're told! But then, the man with the shade only describes fear with his own words - "A Power of Darkness" "..." keeping behind you however you face about." And I think it's sometimes hard to avoid the feeling of fear, when you find yourself in a place where fear is the rule like the house in the story.
Thanks
Tanguene
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) October 16th, 2008, 04:22 PM
Dear Chris, Tanguene & All,
Very interesting reading!
Now, coming from the darkness of the"haunted house" to the light of our day and mind, fortunately, we think that the narrator's reflection upon his experience can be interpreted like this: fear in life might prevent humans from accomplishing their projects, insights, which is not healthy and desirable. It might destroy completely people's thoughts and imagination to go ahead.
Many thanks and warm regards.
Maria
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ChrisL (210 posts) October 26th, 2008, 10:55 PM
Hi Tanguene and Maria
Your comments made me think beyond the text and consider fear as one os the basic human feelings. I was just discssuing this with a friend when he pointed out that 'the most powerful leaders in the world were not really loved or admired, but feared.'
Fear can be also the key for action and survival.
I wonder what drove the narrator to face his own fears. I don't really think he wanted to prove anything to others, but to himself.
Looking forward to some comments on the points above :)
Cheers - Chris
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rawya (1 post) October 29th, 2008, 10:55 AM
Dear Chris,
Like all good works of art, the story handles various themes. An intersting theme here is the 'Power of Darkness'.
'so long as this house of sin endures', black fear will continue to prevail. I believe the message is; we will continue to live in fear as long as we choose to endure our sins rather than get rid of them. Sin creates darkness and darkness creates fear.
The narrator tries to dispel the common belief (that the house is haunted ) but he is not the hero he thinks he is. He is not a match to this mission since, according to christian faith, he endures sin.
A probing question to ask is; "what is the sin?".
Thank you. It is really food for thought.
Regards,
rawya
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sundaresh07 (3 posts) October 29th, 2008, 11:12 AM
Hello!
I would like to quote from H.D.Thoreau, who says that we should not fear anything but that we should have confidence in ourselves when we want to attemt some thing . But, really some of these old stories take us back to the times when radio and T.V. were not yet invented and eole had to face the silence of the night in huts and cabins far away from others. It was in times like the one in the story that the notion of ghosts and withches and all sorts of magic and sorcery were invented and we must remmeber that the idea of God and the devil and ghosts etc are to be found at roughly the same time in all cultures across the world,just as the idea of science is in all countries across the world today. These sort of ideas immerse the entire world. The attemt by the narrator to ward off his fear by rationality and logic is also there in almost all cultures today. So , maybe there is something to the idea of God and Heaven etc, even though we may try to fight it with raionality and logic. What do you think- is all this correct?
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Tanguene (215 posts) October 31st, 2008, 08:45 AM
Dear All,
Reading the comments from the group is another happy experience you get from being a member of the forum.
I was really challenged by the question: "What is the sin?" and while thinking about the question I was enjoing Sundaresho7 reaction. Then, I decided I'm going to read Ken Follet's The Pillars of the Earth story.
This story is good at explaining about the sin. I can tell a passage where a woman who is seen as a whore (I don't remember her name, but it's Tom "Builder" second wife) by the priests. One day she was cross as she was sent away from the monastery for her sin, you know what happened: She pissed over a open bible and other holy things saying words like "curse on it! curse on it!"
I was agap like saying what a oh oh oh what a woman!, what a woman, but that's a good story telling by the author. praise the author.
Thanks
Tanguene
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) October 31st, 2008, 07:24 PM
Hello, Chris !
Precisely, I think the narrator just intended to accomplish something unusual for him. He wanted to overcome "darkness", "fear" because he didn't identify with the "haunted" feature.
I think his beliefs go in a totally different way. He might want to tell us there should be found a place for brightness, courage, morality. Another face of mankind's nature. So, his usual behaviour does not match the breaking of God's laws.
Many thanks for your work and your great capacity for stimulating these talking points!
As Tanguene had already said, this is a very enriching experience.
Warm regards,
Maria
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 3rd, 2008, 10:27 AM
Dear All,
Thank you for all enlightening comments on the “The Red Room” short story. With our comments it's no longer a short story, if short stories are short for their size, number of words etc..., but the impact of this one can be better than even the one of a not short story!
I think the narrator was driven to face his fear (or his courage) because the family living in this "haunted" house didn't and couldn’t help him relieve them of their fear, which seems was the mission he was there for. We are not told if the narrator (who seems to be a policeman!) was called to come to this house, but I suspect he was the characters who called him were not ready for being helped out or they couldn’t be helped shake their fear off. And then, it seems they wanted the narrator to leave them/the house with this sense of fear and allow him take part of it (fear) with him. That’s when fear can pass from one person to another. Chris comment which says 'the most powerful leaders in the world were not really loved or admired, but feared' is true and I believe. Some societies use fear for education and in my country you can hardly separate fear from being respectful. Even parents teach children to fear and it has become part of our culture, tough some parents have now understood fear shouldn’t be the way of education. That’s the reason leadership in our countries (I mean my country and other with similar culture) is seen as the courage to bring fear upon all those you rule over!
It's hard to help someone who cannot help oneself even a bit, when in life we have to always try, I think.
Thanks Chris, Maria do Ceu and all the members of the forum, this is a very enriching experience.
Tanguene
PS: I was reading a newsletter with good stories about self-publishing and how an author has become a writer. I thought we could share this:
http://www.firstwriter.com/newsletter/archive/2008/fwn68.htm
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rahel (7 posts) November 3rd, 2008, 05:49 PM
I am relatively new here, but do so enjoy having a quick peep at the discussions in passing. Am so impressed by those who contribute regularly to keep this forum alive.
On the present topic, I'd like to take this opportunity to thank Chris on 2 counts: 1) I was unaware that HG Wells had short stories to his credit and this has been a revelation of sorts.
2) If it wasn't for this discussion, I'd have just taken the story at face value - a ghost story written purely for entertainment and wouldn't have delved into the concepts of fear and human imagination.
Fear is a vast topic, but I can only think of simplifying it like this for the moment. There are rational fears - ( one should fear God, fear touching fire, fear doing evil etc )-- and there are the irrational fears(fear of dark, ghosts, pserhaps things like fear of water etc). The rational fears have to be acquired,and the irrational ones overcome.
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ChrisL (210 posts) November 7th, 2008, 10:51 AM
Dear Rahel
Welcome to the group! I'm really happy to have you here and to know that you have found the experience enjoyable. Thanks a lot for yur comments :)
Fear is indeed a fascinating topic and it's also interesting to see that both you and Sundaresh have established a conection between fear and rationality.
Can science and the ideals of the Illuminism overcome fear? What are the rational and irrational fears, to use Rahel's distinction? Do you agree with such categorisation?
It's really becoming an interesting debate here :)
Looking forward to reading your responses.
Cheers - Chris
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ChrisL (210 posts) November 7th, 2008, 10:57 AM
Dear Rawya, Tanguene & All
Fascinating the idea of sin. Thanks for bringuing this to the debate!
I come from a Christian tradition and sin is something that is interwoven in the very fabric we are made of and it takes a bit for us to realise how pervasive this concept is. I really would like to know about the concept of sin in other religious traditions.
As for sin in the story, I think that indeed, the shadow of past deeds darkens the house and the lives of people living there. Is there a difference between 'sin' and 'guilt'?? I wonder...
Cheers - Chris
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) November 9th, 2008, 07:36 PM
Dear Chris, Tanguene & All
To some extent, this is a very difficult question, Chris. Anyway, we think "sin" might be taken as a subjective concept depending on the person´s traditional beliefs and principles of morality.
Within the Christian faith, telling a lie, stealing, murder, are examples of immoral acts. These are "sins".
Some Christians talk about "deadly sins" as being fatal to salvation of the soul. There are even the so-called "seven deadly sins": pride, covetousness, lust, anger, gluttony, envy, sloth.In our view, there's some exaggeration when it comes to pride and sloth...
As for "guilt", we think it has more to do with the condition of feeling/ recognising of wrong-doing.Either we can feel it or others could tell us the reasons of our wrong-doing, we think...
After all, Chris, this topic isn't that easy as we could
imagine!
I´m also looking forward to learning from others.
Warm regards,
Maria
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kamal (1 post) November 10th, 2008, 02:01 AM
Hi chris, thanks for the story. I found the story The Red Room by H.G Wells very interesting and thrilling .The narrator 'I' was enthusiastic and courageous to hunt the haunted room of the old fellows. Fear of Darkness, which can be overcome by courage , strong will power and confidence, is the main theme of the story. Fear sometimes invite nevrousness in many people that distract them from the real task. but here even after being scared ',I' gathers courage which is positive approach and that led him to success.Fear of Death,Fear of not achieving the goal, Fear of loosing something is always there in our life. I think these all helps us to accomplish our goal.
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 11th, 2008, 06:56 AM
Dear Kamal,
I really enjoyed the idea that says "fear of loosing something is always there in life". I sometimes feel I have this kind of fear, but then sometimes I realize this is the fear holding me back to not get something.
The way you interpret the story and the fact that you look at the "I" as a character who gathered courage and was succeful in the end, that brings new light to the story.
Thanks
Tanguene
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 11th, 2008, 08:22 AM
Thanks Chris, Maria and All,
The dabate about sin is not an easy one, "this is a very difficult question" as Maria said.
The biliefs behind the whole idea of sin might be pervasive, I agree, but the effect among people who bilieve in sin I don't think is to take for granted. In my country you see and learn about people who are affected by this daily and as there are people clever enough to take advantage of any bilief or human weakness, you learn there are people promoting this principles of fear and sin to their advantage. It's their job!
I can tell a true story of a local TV channel in my country. After a terror/vampire sopeopera the coming up programme is a church (praying) programme and you're sitting there. You see a lot of people attending this. The sope opera and the praying are two different programes and I'm not saying which is right, but there're people who don't know how to separate them an their feelings get mixed up at once. They find it hard to stand up and move to their lives after watching this. they sit waiting for the salvation.
There're a lot of examples I could give, but this can be a good example.
For instance, I come from a Christian/African mixed tradition and my mother always expect me not fall in sin (The sins Maria describes were really the ones my parents have told us not to let us fall into). It's when sin and guilt come like one thing. If my mother knew I've done something wrong, I'd feel the weight of sin on my shoulders wherever I went and in whatever else I did. I couldn't desapoint her again before she forgave me.
Tanguene
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adolatkal (44 posts) November 16th, 2008, 01:39 PM
Dear Online English Readers!
I guess the most of us are English teachers! Therefore, I would like to discuss the role of quotations in the English learning process! How the quotations from the read books relate to a school, community or national events or issue as a stimulus for English learners’ speaking activities?
Halima
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 18th, 2008, 07:11 AM
Dear Halima,
The question on the use of quotations is concerning when we look at how "writers" tend to often use it. Sometimes I think it's too much, but sometimes I think that's the way it is.
Why? We read a lot of things now and sometimes we forget where we learned about this and that thought. While we're aware that some of the things we say are not our original thought, tough we no longer remember to whom it belongs, we quote.
There're some exageration, but you can always find the reason for that. For example, from the question "WHAT SIN IS" we entered our comments, but if, for example, I suppose that it's possible that we have different understanding of the word SIN, I can quote it. Another example is the use of every "writer"quoted in this post, I give the word a vague meaning simply to say I might not mean writers in its full sense.
We must be against plagiarism, I think!
That's my contribution
Tanguene
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adolatkal (44 posts) November 18th, 2008, 04:55 PM
Dear Tanguene!
Thank you for your contribution! I always try to use Quotations in the Pre-writing activity. I would like to arouse my English class’s interest in the writing topic. The rationale here is that wisdom passes from age to age-from mind to mind and soul to soul-in the form of recorded words. I post some quotation (also these words of wisdom), they usually stimulate students' speaking activities in the form of Brainstorming and Debate.
Halima
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) November 18th, 2008, 08:51 PM
Dear Adolatkal & Tanguene,
I've found this talking point brought by Adolatkal very interesting.So I'd like to share with you my views on it.
Firstly, let me tell you that I always try to value other people's words/thoughts/feelings/opinions either written or spoken.And whenever I think there's a great idea, with a deep insight I usually register it. It means it has caused such an impact on me that I definitely try to "treasure" it. And it might happen for beneficial purposes.
For example, on reading a piece of literature, e.g. a novel, an essay, a poem, even any particular view from these dedicated online English Readers, I enjoy that particular register/quote to reflect upon it.
As a teacher I've often used quotes from different reliable sources, duly identified, of course, to promote topic discussions within the classroom atmosphere; to motivate learners for improving their reading skills, and also inviting them to illustrate some of those thoughts or imagery (art students enjoy doing so).
If we were allowed to pick a quote amidst our favourite ones, I would certainly enjoy presenting it next time...
Best Regards
Maria
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adolatkal (44 posts) November 19th, 2008, 07:03 AM
Dear ALL!
I usually prepare the posters. They include:
a )The author's name,
b) The source of the quotation,
c) Any useful commentary I have on the circumstances the creation of the piece.
I file the posters of the quotations under subject headings such as:
-Search for identity
-Life is...
-Charity
-Keys of Civil Society as Diversity, Respect ,Tolerance and Consensus.
Halima
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) November 19th, 2008, 09:35 AM
Dear Halima & All,
Excuse me, I'm not sure about my right address to you, dear Halima or Adolatkal(?). My apologies to you.
Now I'd like to thank you for your appproach to using/organising quotations. I guess you must have a thick file containing very relevant subjects.
Would you mind selecting one of those about any of the subjects referred to? Many thanks indeed.
Best regards,
Maria
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 20th, 2008, 06:40 AM
Dear All,
Thanks Halima for this online lecture. the way you explain how to use quotation in teaching must have a great impact on the learners. and I'm a learner too!
Thanks
Tanguene
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adolatkal (44 posts) November 20th, 2008, 06:49 AM
Dear Maria!
My name is HALIMA. My nickname is ADOLATKALAN comprising the name of my GRANDDAUTHER -ADOLAT and her family name - Kalanov. ADOLAT means in UZBEK JUSTICE!
Dear Maria! There are so many approaches in Piling and Filing of Quotations! I am accustomed to begin my English lesson with some of them! It is a very effective Starting Point! Mark Twain said: “Habit is habit, and not to be flung out of the window by any man, but coaxed downstairs a step at a time." I and my students try to up stair with all the Wise Words, spoken in English or translated into English.
Halima.
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MON AMI (44 posts) November 21st, 2008, 09:53 AM
This is a good lesson yeah!
thanks for that. I had seen it before, but it sounds nice to read again and refresh my memory! i can see we have a good teacher here, and its really a nice starting point... for any class!
congrats!
Mon Ami
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) November 21st, 2008, 01:42 PM
Dear Halima,
This morning I had sort of a meeting with "peoples and cultures" through your wise explanation of your nickname. I'm grateful to you.
I also thank you for the quotation by Mark Twain.Very interesting!
But... I confess I had no intention "to fling you out of the window." Do you think I've exaggerated when I requested a simple quotation from the huge amount you have filed? If I did so, I do apologise.
I'm also used to dealing with contextualised topic subjects.It's very important to understand how language works in diverse contexts and cultures, as you know.
Thank you very much.
Maria
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adolatkal (44 posts) November 21st, 2008, 03:35 PM
Dear FRIENDS!
I make a report about activities of our Online Reader in Residence at our UzTEA Annual Conference. Being so different, living so far from each other,we all belong to one Discussion boards at enCompass Culture! We have shared our opinions, exchanged so many Alerts! The very soul of our online English Reading Club sounds like “READ, READ and READ MORE”!!!
Dear Friends!
What quotations, what wise WORDS can help me to describe our activities! How can I attract new Uzbek Online English READERS!
Halima
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MON AMI (44 posts) November 22nd, 2008, 12:51 PM
ADOLAKTAL... this sounds like an indian name, is it?! the thing is that i have a poem which is more related to indian faces, oh, indian faces yeah... and i would like to share with anyone from India, to help me to see if it sounds cute or not!
Halima, you are indian, sure!?
Mon Ami
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Sush (1 post) November 22nd, 2008, 01:18 PM
Dear friends,
I thoroughly enjoyed reading The Red Room By H.G Wells. It was like a horror movie but not without a deep thought.
The lines that gripped me are;
“The worst of all the things that haunt poor mortal man," said I; "and that is, in all its nakedness - Fear!”
“And you have seen it. And we, who have lived here all our lives, have never set eyes upon it. Because we have never dared ...” and ‘A power of darkness.’
Fear to explore, experiment and experience life fully leave one ignorant and innocent of many beautiful things life has to offer. We unknowingly build walls around ourselves and limit our decisions to the most treaded paths.
It is a great story.
Sush
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 24th, 2008, 07:00 AM
Dear Sush,
Thanks for your great comment on the story. The quotes you bring, are the lines which I found more deep in the interpretation of this story, and by reading your comment it was like reading the story again.
Thank you very much for offering me a good day.
Peace of heart is the
Piece of your soul that
We happilly share together!
Thanks
Tanguene
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ChrisL (210 posts) November 27th, 2008, 02:00 AM
Hello everyone
First of all, welcome to Kamal and Sush and welcome back to Halima!! Nice to have you here again :)
Indeed, sn and guilt are not easy topics and maybe it help us to see that what apparently could be consider an easy, entertaining piece of reading can open up windows to lots of fellings, concepts and beliefs. Thanks a lot to Maria and Tanguene for sharing their views on this.
As for quotes, I woudl just like to add that using some key quotes from a short story or a novel used as a pre-reading activity may raise learners curiosity about the text, help them to discuss, explore, feel more comfortable with the reading.
Anyone with experience using quotes in this way?
Cheers - Chris
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) November 27th, 2008, 09:21 PM
Hello, Chris & Everyone!
I'm very glad to have you here again, closer to us all, at this shared board. Here we have the opportunity to communicate and learn together with the other participants despite distance.
Everyday we feel that different views, thoughts and experiences are helping us all to construct knowledge.
In fact, dear Chris, using quotes as a pre-reading activity is more likely to arouse learners' curiosity and boost their motivation towards the text.
If you allow me, I'd also suggest this way of using quotes so as to develop learners'reading & speaking skills: as a while-reading activity, we could invite learners to select two (or more) favourite quotes from the short story or novel. They could work in pairs or small groups. Each pair /group would discuss the selected quotes for 5 minutes or so... Then each pair/group would inform the other learners about those selected quotes and present their views on it.
A short discussion could also be set by the teacher , eliciting ideas from the class.
By the way, Chris, when are we moving again to poetry?
Many thanks indeed.
Maria
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Tanguene (215 posts) November 28th, 2008, 06:42 AM
Dear Everyone,
I must confess whenever I read a post from my colleagues members of the board with a positive view on my comment or contribution to the discussions, I feel the joy of being, of growth there deep inside me. thanks to Chris, Maria, Mon Ami, Shanguita, and to all.
And sorry to Aglaude who once couldn't tell my gender, I think it was in the Poet's Corner site. I think this is the only one desadvantage of our online discussion, we can share the best of our thoughts and not see each other. Peharps this is the only one advantage too!
I'm a 29 years young man living in Maputo, Mozambique, the southern region of Africa. And I'm proud i've made friends overseas, good friends like you through sharing our reading experiences. the experience which pays off if I look at how it has positively influenced me.
Thanks
Tanguene
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ChrisL (210 posts) November 30th, 2008, 12:01 PM
Hi Maria do Ceu, Tanguene & Everyone
I'm really glad to be back here!
I make your words mine - I think it is a fantastic opportunity to be able to share ideas with all of you. Thanks for this!
Thanks also for the ideas of quotes for while-reading activity. I wonder if it would work online as well... Let's make an experiment? Let's try it here??
Here is my quote for this story,
'The echoes rang up and down the spiral staircase, and a shadow came sweeping up after me, and one fled before me into the darkness overhead. I came to the landing and stopped there for a moment, listening to a rustling that I fancied I heard; then, satisfied of the absolute silence, I pushed open the baize-covered door and stood in the corridor. '
Looking forward to your interpretations and comments on it :)
Cheers - Chris
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ChrisL (210 posts) November 30th, 2008, 12:04 PM
Hi All
Maria asks when we will be moving to Poetry again.
Any time!!! The forum is open there for all of us to post our poems at any moment we feel like sharing poems with each other :)
Cheer - Chris
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Sanghita (44 posts) December 1st, 2008, 02:29 PM
Dear Chris, Tanguene (I thought u were a woman/girl and therefore addressed you as Tanna in some of my posts - foolish me :D ), Mon Ami, Maria and everyone in the group.
I'm sorry to becaome a dormant partner in the group for some personal reasons and I missed (e)talking to u.
I'm back now. Since Chris sends out the GREEN (GO) signal for poetry again - Hurrah - here I'm at your service with a poem:
Coming back
Breaking the bleak beaks of barrenness
life unleashes itself.
Sun still shined
Earth spinned
Water flowed
Birds chirped.
But moon marooned
And stars stopped shivering from afar.
I waited for a glimpse of the known world
of the imagined world
of the world to be.
Existence passes away
Words remain.
The ownership of my words
I bestow upon you.
If they remain
They'll tell you
Once upon a time there was ...
With love
Sanghita
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) December 1st, 2008, 08:47 PM
Hello, Chris & Everyone
We are very glad to have you here again!
We all understand you must have been very busy with your professional activities.
Well, let's try here with some further quotes, in this case that one selected by you, Chris. Here are my thoughts:
It is very interesting to notice a somewhat cyclic projection of the sounds accompanying the "spiral" staircase and the movement of the shadows.
The narrator seems to need some relief, I think. So he stopped for a moment but ... he kept imagining there might be other sounds. Then he finally calmed down for he faced "absolute silence"again. Then he ventured through the corridor, where he was likely to feel more freedom...
Cheers,
Maria
P.S. (Let me tell you that snow is falling down in some areas of my homeland!!Outside is icy, here (at the discussion board) there is warmth!
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pilar (40 posts) December 2nd, 2008, 02:16 AM
hi poetry lovers! here goes one that I love, José martí wrote:It is necessary to make virtue fashionable. and this poem that I want to share with you, i´m sending you the original and the translation:
Cultivo Una Rosa Blanca
Por Jose Marti
Cultivo una rosa blanca
En julio como en enero,
Para el amigo sincero
Que me da su mano franca.
Y para el cruel que me arranca
El corazon con que vivo,
Cardo ni ortiga cultivo,
Cultivo una rosa blanca.
I Cultivate a White Rose
By Jose Marti
I cultivate a white rose
In July as in January
For the sincere friend
Who gives me his hand frankly.
And for the cruel person who tears out
the heart with which I live,
I cultivate neither nettles nor thorns:
I cultivate a white rose.
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 2nd, 2008, 12:49 PM
Dear Chris, Maria and Everyone,
I was trying to get a meaning to your quote for the story. In short, I think the narrator wanted to tell us that "he felt nervous as he was going close to the Red Room, fearing the invisible, untill he understood the noisy he heard was in his mind, and that gave him the courage to open the door which led him to the corridor" and he had sigh of relief (relief or freedom as suggested by Maria) he needed to have.
My quote for a pre-reading would be:
“I flung out my arms in a vain effort to thrust that ponderous blackness away from me, and lifting up my voice,
screamed with all my might, once, twice, thrice. Then I think I must
have staggered to my feet. I know I thought suddenly of the moonlit
corridor, and with my head bowed and my arms over my face, made a
stumbling run for the door.”
And welcome your comments,
Tanguene
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Maria do Céu Costa (136 posts) December 2nd, 2008, 01:05 PM
Hello, Sanghita!
Firstly, a very warm welcome from us!
We have also missed you, your sensitive words, reliefs, hope, you have so kindly shared with this community.
As for your latest poem: how nicely you've restarted with Nature presenting its positive cycle! Except for the "moon" and "stars", we think...
Be sure that your words will remain as a generous token from you! We want to count on you here for long! (I guess you are a young lady, much younger than me!)
Take care and warm regards,
Maria
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 2nd, 2008, 02:19 PM
Dear Sanghita,
I will echo the “hurray” for the GREEN (go) which opens the way for sharing your creative work again.
Once Upon a Time
There was…, has always been
A bird with a silver plumage from which flow
Like rivers streams across into sea flow
Like brave words from the poetess flow
Like the sweet sounds the bird chirped
And your words surely remained
In our hearts and in your songs
Pleasant songs the birds chirped
Saying…once upon a time
There was and will always be
That bird with a silver plumage
With sweet songs!
Tanguene
And I'm very sorry for when I understood you had taken me for a woman ("which I would enjoy being") it took long untill I learned I had to tell the truth.
Tanguene
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MON AMI (44 posts) December 3rd, 2008, 07:09 AM
Pilar, I liked this poem!
it sounds like its about friendship in general, and the way we need to behave with people who like us and even with those who dont, so that we dont build a chain of hate among us!
and it reminds me of some verses in the bible as well, which say that we dont need to hit who hit us, and we can simply forgive, as Jesus prayed God to forgive those who hang him up in the cross. so, we need to be doing good things for all, no matter how they treat us... aham, thats so cool! Lets grow this rose all over the world!
Yo tambien, cultivo una rosa blanca! (me gusta mucho!)
Mon Ami
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MON AMI (44 posts) December 3rd, 2008, 07:34 AM
Oh, Tanguene, lets back to Sanghita. imagine you are a woman: what would you do to promote Gender Equality in your Community? eheh, te apanhei rapaz!...
Now lets share one poem about a vodka i would like to drink, and which i have never seen, but they say its so nice! I don't drink at all, just Amarula, but i will start drinking the day i find Shalimar. Is there anyone who has tried it?! Ok, I ve got it here, lets share.
Sharing Shalimar!
I have been sneaking into
my dreams…
shaking emotions
and roots of taste,
blowing the future
like balloons thrown
in an empty windy hill,
Nothing else than
the king tides
of your shoulders
throwing me like a crab
hiding inside out
and rushing all the way
in search for a sip,
Diva or dove, oh!...
home of peace and silence,
ah!, the round universe
drawn in a single smile
shining like the Spring sunflowers!
I can see nothing else
than the chocolate skin
and the bright pearl
rolling
round and round
and waving like
the only gift of my incredible eyes…
Ah!…
natural flavours
lost and found
in a simple look
buried in your drops,
digging caged feelings
and moving like two dolphins
diving into the cloudy sky… so high!,
Nothing else stands on top
than the only bird singing
like the morning bell sounding
like the only angel flying
like the morning window opening
like the only sun shining
like the only Brahma blessing
our endless vodka…
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 3rd, 2008, 11:02 AM
Dear Pilar,
The poem by Jose Marti is a great thread. I like the way it changes the gear at the 5th line when it comes frightiningly(and for the cruel person...) but then, the poet could keep his good mood, for he cultivate the white rose for the sincere friend as well as for the cruel. It's satiric! The white rose is like a flag in the poet's heart.
I'd like to share this:
Civilização
Antigamente
(antes de Cristo)
os homens erguiam estádios e templos
e morriam na arena como cães.
Agora...
Também já constroem Cadillacs.
by José Craveirinha
Civilization
Since then
(Before Christ)
Men have built stadiums and temples
And ended up like dogs in the arena.
Even more…
They have built Cadillacs too.
(I translated the piece for the sake of sharing. The reading of this poem start with a good mood and changes to a bad and unconfortable mood in the last two lines)
Jose Craveirinha is one of the best African poets, and a national hero in Mozambique, his remains are resting at the hero square, he was "crowned" as a hero who fought using the most powerful weapon on earth: The WORD .
He’s work is in Portuguese (and some poems he enjoyed mixing up with traditional languages like Ronga). Some of his work you can find translated into English, but such translation might be like the one I attempted to bring to the forum. I mean, we don’t have his poems in a collection translated into English.
Tanguene
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pilar (40 posts) December 4th, 2008, 12:14 AM
Thanks Tanguene for seeing what I did not see. Your vision, no doubt , enriches unseen perceptions. This is what i love about literature: the different readings of the WORD that allow us to enter different Worlds.
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pilar (40 posts) December 4th, 2008, 12:19 AM
Hi Mon Ami
I really liked the idea of the symbol of the white rose as a Universal token of that which should be grown.
Ps: your Spanish is great!
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adolatkal (44 posts) December 4th, 2008, 01:09 AM
Dear friends!
I would like to discuss this fake literature:
The Professor and the Jar
A Professor stood before his philosophy class and had some items in front of him. When the class began, wordlessly, he picked up a very large and empty mayonnaise jar and proceeded to fill it with golf balls. He then asked the students if the jar was full. They agreed that it was.
So the Professor then picked up a box of pebbles and poured them into the jar. He shook the jar lightly. The pebbles rolled into the open areas between the golf balls. He then asked the students again if the jar was full. They agreed it was.
The professor next picked up a box of sand and poured it into the jar. Of course, the sand filled up everything else. He asked once more if the jar was full. The students responded with unanimous “yes.”
The Professor then produced two cups of coffee from under the table and poured the entire contents into the jar, effectively filling the space between the grains of sand.
“Now,” said the professor, as the laughter subsided, “I want you to recognize that this jar represents your life. The golf balls are the important things – your family, your children, your health, your friends, and your favorite passions – things that if everything else was lost and only they remained, your life would still be full.
The pebbles are the other things that matter like your job, your house, and your car. The sand is everything else – the small stuff.
“If you put the sand into the jar first,” he continued, “there is no room for the pebbles or the golf balls. The same goes for life. If you spend all your time and energy on the small stuff, you will never have room for the things that are important to you. Pay attention to the things that are critical to your happiness. Play with your children. Take time to get medical checkups. Take your partner out to dinner. Play another 18.
There will always be time to clean the house and fix the disposal. “Take care of the golf balls first, the things that really matter. Set your priorities. The rest is just sand.”
One of the students raised her hand and inquired what the coffee represented. The Professor smiled. “I’m glad you asked. It just goes to show you that no matter how full your life may seem, there’s always room for a couple of cups of coffee with a friend.’
This text was given for discussion in the British Council seminar. It was presented as a work of literature. I have my doubts…
Halima
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MON AMI (44 posts) December 4th, 2008, 02:00 AM
Yeah, translating Jose Craveirinha's writings is our homework Tanguene and its gonna be a huge task, but ok, dont shout!...
I like "Civilization". It sounds like its all about both sides of the story of civilization: the good side and its by-products. Temples and stadiums are huge and good, but people had to die so as to build them. Nowadays, again, people still die in those fast and expensive cars, still do bad things in order to get those cars, still kill and kill themselves because of those cars...
anyway, they are many interpretations, but the thing is that development/civilization has its own negatives effects we all know! In short, capitalism...
Mon Ami
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adolatkal (44 posts) December 5th, 2008, 07:15 AM
Dear Chris!
Dear Friends at encompassculture!
My CS friends in the “BOOKS” thread in the Forum “International Politics” discuss the following read books:
-Steve Coll's " by Ghost Wars
-"A Fine Balance" by Rohinton Mistry about the begging industry in India
-Naomi's Klein "No Logo" and "Shock Doctrine"
- "Of Mice and Men" by John Steinbeck!
-Chimananda Ngozi Adiche - Half of a Yellow Sun and Purple Hibiscus.
-Robert Fisk, “The great war for civilization”
- The Dusty Foot Philosopher
Abdelrahman Munif :”Cities of salt”
Robert Fisk, “The great war for civilization”
Richard Powers : « The time of our singing » Carlos Ruiz Zafón : « The shadow of the wind
Vikram Seth: “An equal music” (
Khaled Husseini: “A thousand splendid suns”
Ellis Avery : « The tea house fire."
Dear English Readers!
I am so happy for being a part of this English speaking Community!
But I hear these titles only in this Books Thread!
Are these my CS friends living in other PLANET? No! All of them are living in the Global Village !
I live here too! But why must I analyze this fake literature then? Even in the British Council Seminar called "Professional development by reading literature?"
Halima
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 5th, 2008, 07:50 AM
Dear Halima,
I enjoyed "The professor and the jar" and I confess it's powerful in terms of meaning and sense of life. We should love our family, children without setting conditions for that, mainly if you really have children. I've two boys, aged 5 and 16 months. But I think the story is too philosofical to be a work of literature. That's my opinion, since I look at literature as art, and a work of art should allow many interpretations and subjective meanings and help relax. But this story is too objective and the professor there is doing his job of showing part of so many philosophies and ways of looking at life. Another professor could choose the reverse and present another logical meaning of life using the same material, and the story could have a different impact on us, readers!
It's a good reading.
Tanguene
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 5th, 2008, 08:06 AM
Dear Mon Ami,
It's nice to see we have work to do: translating Craveirinha's work. I'm planning to visit his house, which is now a museum, along the season holiday. Translating Craveirinha is our responsibility, and we shouldn't let his flame go out. Never!
And you put a powerful question by asking what I would to promote Gender Equality. I think we can share this responsibiliy, all of us. I suggest we review the Reader's Corner project we are now designing and bring a powerful gender perspective. And make sure we put women (the most powerful work of art nature has offered humanity. Complex and full of sense in itself!) and men (the art I never understood in life) to come and share together their reading experiences and strenghts. It will be "our endless vodka"!
Thanks
Tanguene
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Sanghita (44 posts) December 5th, 2008, 03:17 PM
Dear Mon Ami
This poem is fantastic. I particularly liked this stanza "Ah!…
natural flavours
lost and found
in a simple look
buried in your drops,
digging caged feelings
and moving like two dolphins
diving into the cloudy sky… so high!,"
We all are digging "caged feelings" whenever we can or afford to. Sometimes we have to keep our feelings caged in spite of our earnest desire to free them. What do you say?
Love
Sanghita
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Sanghita (44 posts) December 5th, 2008, 03:21 PM
Dear Halima
Thanks a lot for sharing this reading list with us. I haven't read all of them - in fact I read only a few to be precise. Thanks for letting us know. This is the beauty of such a forum. The knowledge base becomes manyfold here :)
Love
Sanghita
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Sanghita (44 posts) December 5th, 2008, 03:22 PM
Dear Tanguene
Please go ahead and translate Craveirinha's work!!! that's how we'll be able to know about poets of different cultures. I'll look forward to reading them.
Love
Sanghita
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adolatkal (44 posts) December 6th, 2008, 10:43 AM
Dear READERS!
Let’s discuss "Astoria " play of Jura Soyfer .
On the 8-th of December we all celebrate very significant event not only for the culture of Austria but the whole World too: the birthday of playwright Jura Soyfer.
Dear online READERS!In his play " Astoria" Soyfer told, that the Uzbek language is language of the future. Having said that, he had not sinned against the truth .In fact, in global world respect for languages and cultures of other people is a condition of stability and self-preservation.
Sounds so interesting and promising for the Uzbek nation!
Halima
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Tanguene (215 posts) December 8th, 2008, 06:56 AM
Dear All,
I enjoy telling stories, and "the mouth owes stories the debt of speech..." as Okey Ndibe (a Nigerian writer) say in his novel "Arrows of Rain". He means stories that must be told don't forgive silence! And the novel teaches us not to rely on the counterfeit coin of silence! (Am I right Mon Ami!!)
"A voiceless man is as good as dead" (Okey Ndibe) and I will tell the story why "I cultivate a white rose" any time of my life now. I started today, when after yesterday night I was listening to a friend telling me his story of a broken relantioniship, I arrived home and learned that my wife has almost done the same as my friend's wife.
Then, I had to struggle for a sound sleep!
And then, early in the morning a went jogging and you know what happened! My mind browsed the "...white rose" by Jose Marti, Pilar shared in the forum. In the end I sensed I have the all the verse in my mind and it was playing good with the beats of my heart.
Then, I arrived home and I looked for a print out I have of it. It was the day I learned poets can change the world we live in. "I cultivate a white rose" is my best favourite for now, and it's the first satire teaching me about love, in a romantic satire, and, " I cultivate a white rose". I just needed the seed and now that I have..."I cultivate a white rose"
Thanks Pilar.
Tanguene
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MON AMI (44 posts) December 8th, 2008, 07:44 AM
Dear Sanghita
Hum, well... its good to keep our caged feelings when the situation is not suitable to free then out!
Sometimes its good to free then out, even they go astray, so long us they don't live with us like cancer breaking our hearts! I mean, sometimes, saying what we feel is part of our relaxation!
Well, for people like Sanghita, don't need to suffer, they just need a paper and a pen to get rid of caged feelings, thats why i like poetry! like now, i would like to drink Shalimar, and now that i don't find it in reality (if you look at the first capital letters of all the stanzas, you can see where they say its found), I find it in words and get drunk!...
regards!
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MON AMI (44 posts) December 8th, 2008, 07:48 AM
Ok Tanguene, we ll do it! iam sure we are going to have that Hero's book translated as soon as possible! The RC is coming on, thats going to be our task!
Its a good idea!
Mon Ami
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